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| |  Posted 17/08/2007 17:03:55 | |
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| also a lot of the other countries play their best eleven U21s.. so for england, the team would include Rooney, Lennon, Richards etc. Noticeably the dutch team included some of their full teams starters.. here this would be thought of as ridiculous. Which shows how the competition is regarded by the FA also.
Cool Cool Coolio... |
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| | | Posted 17/08/2007 17:04:56 | |
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| Born Unlucky (17/08/2007)
Bluewijinov (17/08/2007)
Labmonkey (17/08/2007)
Bluewijinov (17/08/2007)
but they dont select any players from lower leagues or players that arent already in the prem first teams. and bentley would get his call up based on his consistent displays for blackburn not for anything he did in the under 21s. yes, it is more like an england reserves team, actually it's like an england third team. there's 23 in the full squad, so it's almost a third choice eleven. im not knocking anyone for playing for them. i just dont think it is a big deal and should be for younger players who arent already established. David Nugent is a notable example off the top of my head. I wouldn't really call Bentley established though. Relatively speaking, he's quite a late starter as his career took a significant step back when he decided to leave Arsenal. He's only been at Blackburn for a couple of years, so when you compare that to the players who do break through young (Fowler, Oweb, Rooney), he has some catching up to do. There's always going to be exceptions. But Nugent would never get a proper england chance until he joined a prem team and he was known for his goals for preston, he was cack at that U21s tournie, Lita got the goals. Still dont think Nugent will play a competitive game for england, he's worse than Macken. I think bentley has been along with pederson, blackburn's best player for the last couple of seasons and was instantly successful there. he had a full season at norwich before that. and was at arsenal when they were the best, so didnt really stand a chance up against pires and ljungberg but showed good potential. bentley isnt world class. im just saying him not wanting to play for the U21s is understandable. England U21 squad: Alnwick (Tottenham), Carson (Liverpool), Hart (Man City); Baines (Wigan), Cahill (Aston Villa), Ferdinand (West Ham), Hoyte (Arsenal), Onuoha (Man City), Rosenior (Fulham), Taylor (Newcastle), Whittingham (Cardiff); Bentley (Blackburn), Huddlestone (Tottenham), Milner (Newcastle), Noble (West Ham), Reo-Coker (West Ham), Richardson (Man Utd), Routledge (Tottenham); Derbyshire (Blackburn), Lita (Reading), Nugent (Preston), Vaughan (Everton), Young (Aston Villa) maybe Young, Derbyshire and Onuoha have potential for a future england spot. I dont believe any of the others will play for england in a competitive match unless they develop later in their careers. Only two non prem players in the entire squad. And you don't think that the experience they are gaining from playing for the U-21's will aid that development? no i dont, they will improve by playing in the premiership every week, which is clearly their main priority.
Cool Cool Coolio... |
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| | | Posted 17/08/2007 17:22:29 | |
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| Sorry but I can't agree with the reasons for why Bentley withdrew from the squad. He said it was to do with the fact he had just played a full season for Blackburn and was too tired to take take part in a tournement that was at the end of the season! When is they world cup held? at the end of the season, is he going to pull out of that as well due to fatigue? my guess is not.
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| | | Posted 17/08/2007 23:02:58 | |
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| Born Unlucky (17/08/2007)
Surely an U-18 side is even more pointless? How many players that represent their country at that level actually make it into the seniors? Even fewer than those who play at U-21 level. If the U-21's are pointless (which they aren't, IMO) then the U-18's are more so by default. Or are you suggesting that by the age of 17/18 a footballer is complete and there is no more room for development??? If you're going to be contrary then at least think about your argument, for your own sake. I remember we had a player called Dorryl Proffit who was one of the stars of the England U16 (or so) team, along with Lee Croft, and the two of them really stood out. I have absolutely no idea what happened to him, I don't even know if he is in professional football. Anyone know? As BU says, although the younger age groups can give an idea of who is going to be a future star who can cut it at international level, you get much more of an idea through the age groups when they have matured more, and some of them even play first team football. No, England may not play the best players at that level, but it gives some of the promising fringe players, who maybe still have some improving to do, a taste of what it is like at international level. OK, many of them may not make it, but it is better to find that out at a more junior level that doesn't count as much, than to throw them into the senior side and have them out of their depth. It's just a first stage of weeding out the ones who can't cut it unless they improve significantly, and improving the potential and the profile of the ones who may be able to. As for Bentley, well he might believe that the U21s aren't that important for his progression into the full squad, but in that case why has he been playing for them for the past couple of years? Seems he got one call up into the full squad (which his performances for the U21s will undoubtedly have helped with) and thought he'd made it and had nothing more to prove. Not really the attitude you want.
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| | | Posted 17/08/2007 23:10:08 | |
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| d'you reckon micah would've gone if he could have?
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| | | Posted 17/08/2007 23:15:24 | |
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| Paddington Blue (17/08/2007)
d'you reckon micah would've gone if he could have?Yep, I do. He seems like a grounded lad, who doesn't take his 'right' to be in the senior squad for granted. He'll take his chances whenever and wherever he gets them.
Keeper of the heretic's fork of doom. |
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| | | Posted 17/08/2007 23:18:15 | |
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| Paddington Blue (17/08/2007)
d'you reckon micah would've gone if he could have?I'm sure he would.(not sure as in definite, but sure as in i think so, although that doesn't make sense) He was captain wasn't he? I think.
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| | | Posted 17/08/2007 23:22:36 | |
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| me too.
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| | | Posted 17/08/2007 23:26:42 | |
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| Bluewijinov (17/08/2007)
Born Unlucky (17/08/2007)
Bluewijinov (17/08/2007)
Labmonkey (17/08/2007)
Bluewijinov (17/08/2007)
but they dont select any players from lower leagues or players that arent already in the prem first teams. and bentley would get his call up based on his consistent displays for blackburn not for anything he did in the under 21s. yes, it is more like an england reserves team, actually it's like an england third team. there's 23 in the full squad, so it's almost a third choice eleven. im not knocking anyone for playing for them. i just dont think it is a big deal and should be for younger players who arent already established. David Nugent is a notable example off the top of my head. I wouldn't really call Bentley established though. Relatively speaking, he's quite a late starter as his career took a significant step back when he decided to leave Arsenal. He's only been at Blackburn for a couple of years, so when you compare that to the players who do break through young (Fowler, Oweb, Rooney), he has some catching up to do. There's always going to be exceptions. But Nugent would never get a proper england chance until he joined a prem team and he was known for his goals for preston, he was cack at that U21s tournie, Lita got the goals. Still dont think Nugent will play a competitive game for england, he's worse than Macken. I think bentley has been along with pederson, blackburn's best player for the last couple of seasons and was instantly successful there. he had a full season at norwich before that. and was at arsenal when they were the best, so didnt really stand a chance up against pires and ljungberg but showed good potential. bentley isnt world class. im just saying him not wanting to play for the U21s is understandable. England U21 squad: Alnwick (Tottenham), Carson (Liverpool), Hart (Man City); Baines (Wigan), Cahill (Aston Villa), Ferdinand (West Ham), Hoyte (Arsenal), Onuoha (Man City), Rosenior (Fulham), Taylor (Newcastle), Whittingham (Cardiff); Bentley (Blackburn), Huddlestone (Tottenham), Milner (Newcastle), Noble (West Ham), Reo-Coker (West Ham), Richardson (Man Utd), Routledge (Tottenham); Derbyshire (Blackburn), Lita (Reading), Nugent (Preston), Vaughan (Everton), Young (Aston Villa) maybe Young, Derbyshire and Onuoha have potential for a future england spot. I dont believe any of the others will play for england in a competitive match unless they develop later in their careers. Only two non prem players in the entire squad. And you don't think that the experience they are gaining from playing for the U-21's will aid that development? no i dont, they will improve by playing in the premiership every week, which is clearly their main priority. Well, you may not think that, and no doubt Bentley would agree with you, but every country in Europe that can field an U-21 team does so, and they also hold U-21 tournaments in addition to the European Championships, so I'm guessing that they consider it to be a worthwhile exercise. Now, you say other countries play their best eleven at U-21's, but I very much doubt that is true. I doubt if another countries best player was, say, only 19, that they would be playing for the U-21's rather than the senior squad. That just wouldn't make sense. However, there are plenty of players who represent the U-21's who develop at a later stage and go on to be great internationals. Your very own favourite Frank Lampard would be a case in point (though I'd disagree with you on just how great a player Frank is, obviously). Some fall by the wayside and don't make it to the senior team, others, like SP never, feature for the junior sides but become solid first teamers. Point is, and this is why any country bothers with any kind of youth/B team, it gives players the experience and gives coaches an idea of how players will handle international football. By withdrawing from the U-21's last summer Bentley has shown himself to be a bit of a prima donna and that can only harm his international career. It happened to Chris Sutton a few years ago and he, like Bentley, wasn't worth worrying about. Lennon and SWP are far better players. Do you also think City having a reserve side is pointless? Reserves are not only there for senior players who can't get a game for the first team. They are mostly there for youngsters coming out of the acadamy to gain some experience. That is the point. You get it now?
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| | | Posted 17/08/2007 23:30:28 | |
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